An Indian Male Physician’s Perspective on why more Female Physicians than Male Physicians Prefer Physician Spouses

An Indian Male Physician’s Perspective on why more Female Physicians than Male Physicians Prefer Physician Spouses

Jasbina Ahluwalia interviews Dr. Rajeev Fernando.

Dr. Rajeev Fernando has been recognized as one of “America’s Top Doctors in New York” for the specialty of Infectious Disease since 2014. He formerly worked with Doctors Without Borders and runs a charity on behalf of his parents called CHIRAJ (www.CHIRAJ.com). His charity donates masks that meet all the necessary safety standards and have a value of $15.
He is an accomplished doctor with a generous heart and compassion for making the world a better place through the #MaskUpEarth campaign.
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Jasbina:

Interesting. Tell me, okay, so I’m going to switch gears to the personal front for a minute. And I noticed that we’ve looked with lots of female and male physicians over the years, and ranging from medical students to attendings, private practitioners, people beginning practice, people at the top of their game. And I’ve had the privilege of speaking in various physician conferences about relationships, dating over the years.

I’ve noticed the general pattern that I’m hoping you might share your perspective on, just as a male physician, and now as I learned that has female sisters as well. But as a male physician, why do you think, I’ve noticed something interesting, and I would love your candid, your own impressions of this. Why do you think more female physician than male physicians prefer life partners who share their same profession?

So you’ve got more women who are saying, “Oh, I’m in medicine. I prefer a man who’s in medicine too.” Versus you don’t have as many male physicians saying, “Well, I’m in medicine and I’d like my partner to be in medicine as well.” I’m just curious, and this off the cuff. What would you surmise? What would you guess just based on being in the profession?

Dr. Rajeev Fernando:

That is a very good question. And I think, like we had mentioned before, female physicians, there’s a lot of sexism. They go through a lot of very different situations from others, but there’s a lot of sexism that arises. And in my opinion, or my data review actually says, there’s about a 30% to 35% decrease in pay salary also for female physicians. And like I mentioned, female physicians are often asked back for themselves, to get themselves ahead.

I really think that their work obviously stands up for themselves. They’re amazing at what they do. But they have these compromising factors. It’s really, unfortunately brings them down. And I think in that situation, they really look to someone of a similar background in the same field to say, to bridge things together. And I feel some of these factors are really, what we just discussed right now, these factors actually all the more encourage female physicians to be with male physicians so that they understand what the female physician is going through.

Now for example with me, it’s all about equality, but I’m smart enough to recognize that female physicians make up to 30% less than male physicians. Leadership positions are less. I really think, and it really comes down to the personality of the male physician as well. Are they able to put themselves in the shoes of a female physician to understand what they’re going through? And the other thing, which really makes me nauseous is, a lot of patients also, they look at a female physician and say, “Oh, you’re my nurse for the day.” or, “You’re this or that.” And it’s so hard for people to even say, “Oh, my physician is female.”

I mean, these are really real-life problems that I see every day in my practice. So that’s why I think they really look upon male physicians. And as long as the male physician is very understanding, loving and caring, they’re able to see that female physicians are compromised at their work, and I think that’s one of the reasons female physicians like to be with male physicians.

Jasbina:

That’s interesting. Why do you think lesser male physicians are seeking to be female physicians? I know I’m putting you on the spot here, but I’m just curious.

Dr. Rajeev Fernando:

Don’t worry about it. Don’t worry about it. One of my shows when I was a talk show host in India was, we used to call it Red Hot Madrasa Night. So putting it like this, it was a midnight show, actually. So people would call in for love advice.

Jasbina:

Interesting, okay. That’s another show I’ll have to have you on for. That’s interesting.

Dr. Rajeev Fernando:

Of course, of course. You know what’s so interesting, I unfortunately feel there are a lot of men out there, who they can’t handle the power woman. And this is what I’ve noticed. Like for me if I see a power woman, it’s like, “Hey, great. Let’s hold hands. Let’s move forward together and let’s do this. It’s quite straightforward.

But there are a lot of male divisions, and once again, as we just discussed a couple of minutes ago, a lot of males don’t want to do that. They just look at someone as a threat to say, “Oh, my God. She has a higher position than me. She’s doing this, she’s doing that.” And a lot of males may be intimidated by female physicians. That’s what I feel, just off the bat. If you were to, the way you pose these questions, and I think a lot of male physicians may be feeling this inside. That’s one of the things.

And I also think some people, some males say, “Well, you know what? I’m going through this very hectic lifestyle. I try to be with someone who doesn’t have this kind of a lifestyle. So those are some of the things that I really think is why male physicians… just it could be some sort of a complex, which is certainly possible.

And the other thing, which is like, “Oh, the woman is better than me” and all this nonsense, which shouldn’t be existing. And the other is sometimes male physician say, “You know what… I’m doing this on my own. I’ve seen enough. I don’t want my wife to be in the same boat as well. We’re going to be bringing up kids together. And if she has a crazy life, and I have a crazy schedule, how’s it going to work?” And I think these are some of the reasons I feel this way.

Jasbina:

Interesting. Let me ask you a question, do you seeing more male nurses entering the profession of nursing or no? Is that happening or not? In terms of traditionally, nursing has been female. You are seeing more male nurses? Yeah, that is happening?

Dr. Rajeev Fernando:

Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, lots more. I mean, the whole tradition, of course, we had Florence Nightingale bring things out. I can tell you the number of male nurses I know where they conclusively say, “I don’t want to be a doctor.” And people actually ask these nurses and they said, “Why didn’t you do medical school because you’re a guy?” And the answer is very common, where they say, “I prefer bedside patient care to be with the patient every minute.” Unlike doctors aren’t. We round, we leave. But many nurses say, “I just want to be by the patient’s bedside all day long.”

And so, that is one of the reasons I feel there are many, many more male nurses entering the field right now.

Jasbina:

Well, then let me ask you this question, now that more male nurses, and females are entering the field at a higher rate, I believe too, in terms of physicians. There are more male nurses and more female physicians entering the profession. And this is just because you are on the ground, you are seeing the dynamics all the way from med students all the way to fellow attendings. Do you think female physicians and male nurses… what do you think of that partnering that way? I mean, what do you say? Off the cuff, what are your thoughts on that?

I mean, lots of pros and cons, I’m sure. But tell me, do you think that’s something because you seem very forward-thinking in terms of telemedicine, in terms of looking in China in January 2019 and saying, “Nope, this is going to get bad.” So you seem to have those predictions that are pretty interesting and amazing. So what do you think of this, the female physicians and the male nurses?

Do you think that’s something that in the future, the way in the past as a lot of people thought female nurses and now physicians, have partnered?

Dr. Rajeev Fernando:

Yeah, absolutely. For me love knows no barriers. You can’t control who you fall in love with, whether you’re a male doctor and a female nurse or a female physician, and a male nurse. It really knows no boundaries. I mean, I do foresee that. I’m going to, this may be … Sorry to sound a little-

Jasbina:

No editing! Remember Rajeev, there’s no editing.

Dr. Rajeev Fernando:

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, none at all. The thing is, unfortunately, honestly, over the last few years, and I regret to say this. I don’t want to put an arrow in our romance conversation right now. But there are a lot of sexual harassment cases which have come about.

Jasbina:

Sure, absolutely. Me Too movements and…

Dr. Rajeev Fernando:

Exactly, and I think that’s completely appropriate. But now there are a lot of clauses when you sign a contract at the hospital. Say, for example, I have to do a sexual harassment course every day, every year…not every day. That’ll be insane.

Jasbina:

Every day, wow. Rajeev, that’s daily. Just kidding!

Dr. Rajeev Fernando:

No. Every year we have to do that. And just off the bat, it’s a clear cut – you shouldn’t be doing this, which is,as a supervisor, you shouldn’t be asking someone out. If you ask someone out who is below your position, that can be viewed as harassment. The person below can say, “Well, I didn’t want to go on to this person. But I was scared that she’s ahead of me, that she would fire me and things like that.” And that’s applicable for male physicians and female nurses and vice versa. Either way, yeah.

I love Cupid, but this is a situation, which is real right now. And people have to be really, really cautious about, if you’re a supervisory role, you really have to be cautious about who you’re asking out. And it’s very sad. I mean, like I said, love knows no barriers. But this is a legitimate thing that hospitals all over the country are asking for. So it’s kind of put a dent in that situation.

But I don’t know, I’ve always been a forward thinker. And one thing, which I think could be used in the future is just writing an email with some consent to say, “I know this person. I’m interested in this person, and this is completely consensual.” Thinking ahead. I don’t think it’s been employed so far, but I think as long as you have some sort of thing, which says, “Hey, yeah, it’s in writing. You know about this, and this is completely consensual.” And if it’s in writing, I mean, that’s something which I think should in the future, because it’s really sad to breakup love, because of these few cases of sexual harassment. I don’t know the exact numbers, of course it’s happening out there. But love happens all the time, every corner, every day, every minute. And I think this might be a way out.

And this is obviously not data driven or anything of that. But thinking ahead, you really love someone and you want to be with someone, in order to mitigate this possibility of administration coming down on you, things like that. I think this might be a reasonable approach for the future.

Jasbina:

Okay, and that’s very interesting, and it’s a great insight with respect to the whole MeToo movement, and how that, and just in general sexual harassment, which has been there for quite a while. The whole pot, in terms of the dynamics, of female-male dynamics, so that kind of thing. I’m just curious.

Putting aside sexual harassment and the power that any potential, like supervisory issues there. Anything there with just the idea of the different fields, and males who happen to be a nurse and a female who happens to be a doctor? Do you see anything coming in the way of that? Or…do you know what I’m saying? As a male physician, right? Definitely as a male physician. I’m just curious.

Dr. Rajeev Fernando:

Yeah, I think everything is okay. But unfortunately, really, when you work in these bigger places, the administration probably takes a very aggressive role. And I’m going to be honest with you, to all our listeners also. It’s a beautiful feeling to be in love.

But I really want people to really be cognizant of this policy. The last thing you want is you’ve been in training for 20 years and you’ve been working for 20 years to get to where you are. And one of these things can backfire on you and it’s all over.

Jasbina:

Yeah, with something like that, right. No, no, one has to be very careful about that. Right. I was more thinking it doesn’t even have to be in the same workplace. Just the concept. It doesn’t even have to be in the workplace, it could be two different. But just didn’t even have to work in the same institution. I just meant the whole concept of that profession and that profession.

Dr. Rajeev Fernando:

Oh, I think it’s beautiful.

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The above is an excerpt from Jasbina’s interview with Dr. Rajeev Fernando.